00:00:17:19 - 00:00:45:02 Unknown Hello and welcome to voices of the industry, a podcast series bringing you leading industry voices who challenge thinking across transportation, infrastructure and cities. I want. 00:00:45:02 - 00:00:48:20 Unknown Hello and welcome to voices of the industry a stay a podcast. 00:00:48:23 - 00:00:54:02 Unknown Digital infrastructure could soon transform the way highways across the US are maintained and used. 00:00:54:02 - 00:01:01:05 Unknown And the birthplace of this digital highway revolution will appropriately be the home of the US automotive industry. Michigan. 00:01:01:08 - 00:01:09:06 Unknown A connected and automated vehicle corridor or calf corridor will soon be operational across I-94 in southeast Michigan, 00:01:09:06 - 00:01:15:07 Unknown connecting the thriving university town of Ann Arbor with Michigan's longstanding manufacturing hub. Detroit. 00:01:15:11 - 00:01:26:13 Unknown This first of its kind smart road deployment is being developed by Carvana, a company that designs physical and digital infrastructure to enable the safe, efficient and automated transportation of people and goods. 00:01:26:13 - 00:01:32:09 Unknown have now is partnered with the Michigan Department of Transportation to deliver the US's first Cav corridor 00:01:32:14 - 00:01:39:07 Unknown With me today to discuss this exciting development for North American roads is Meghan Brock, senior strategy manager at Coventry. 00:01:39:07 - 00:01:50:16 Unknown Meghan has been with Coventry for three years, where she works on quantifying the value of Coventry's project to the wider ecosystem of road stakeholders. From Reggie says to OEM to departments of transportation. 00:01:50:16 - 00:01:56:02 Unknown Prior to joining Coventry, Meghan worked on demand modeling, business case and impact analysis with Stella. 00:01:56:05 - 00:01:57:21 Unknown Over the course of seven years. 00:01:57:21 - 00:01:58:08 Unknown Hello 00:01:59:01 - 00:02:02:18 Unknown Hello. It's great to be here. Thank you for that introduction. 00:02:02:18 - 00:02:03:14 Unknown problem. 00:02:03:14 - 00:02:05:06 Unknown I was wondering, since, 00:02:05:06 - 00:02:07:07 Unknown I know that people drive a lot in the US. 00:02:07:07 - 00:02:09:02 Unknown When did you get your driver's 00:02:09:19 - 00:02:15:08 Unknown How? I got my driver's license when I was 16. I think the earliest you could get it. 00:02:15:08 - 00:02:17:12 Unknown I did not grow up in a transit 00:02:17:12 - 00:02:18:02 Unknown friendly 00:02:18:02 - 00:02:21:21 Unknown place, so that was how I got around. Well, it's strange. 00:02:21:24 - 00:02:24:23 Unknown That was kind of what I was going to ask. Yeah. So I guess, 00:02:24:23 - 00:02:30:18 Unknown How do you think that this kind of, like, car door technology would improve things for young drivers and those kind of barriers? 00:02:30:18 - 00:02:39:11 Unknown we'll talk a little bit more about what we mean by a cab corridor shortly. But for young drivers today, you know, driving is one of the most dangerous things that 00:02:39:11 - 00:02:40:24 Unknown young people can do. 00:02:40:24 - 00:02:46:20 Unknown cab corridors really are about giving guidance to drivers about how to navigate roadway risks. 00:02:46:20 - 00:02:49:21 Unknown And so especially for young drivers, I think that's important. 00:02:49:21 - 00:02:52:22 Unknown And there's a lot of research about, 00:02:52:22 - 00:02:56:11 Unknown particularly how young drivers respond to, 00:02:56:11 - 00:03:03:07 Unknown information and sentences out how to travel more safely and efficiently. And so I think cab corridors can support that. 00:03:03:11 - 00:03:04:22 Unknown road safety concerns. 00:03:04:22 - 00:03:07:17 Unknown is that, like, a big concern for everyday Americans? But could. 00:03:08:01 - 00:03:19:05 Unknown Well, road safety is a national crisis in this country. We have over 40,000 road fatalities occurring here a year and countless more injury and damage producing crashes. So, 00:03:19:05 - 00:03:26:17 Unknown you know, people face real risk when they get in their cars. And it's a it's a real challenge. The industry is universally focused on. 00:03:26:24 - 00:03:28:14 Unknown That's great. Thank you. 00:03:28:18 - 00:03:41:06 Unknown Also joining us is steerer associate Tony. Father Tony is part of our North American infrastructure team. She's worked at Steph for over 15 years focusing on forecasting demand and revenue to support investors and transport infrastructure. 00:03:41:12 - 00:03:59:13 Unknown A lot of Tony's experience and interest is an understanding and predicting behavioral responses to changes in transportation. This has included estimating the response to the introduction of a Hyperloop in India. Toll roads in South Africa. High speed rail in the US and most recently, corridors in Michigan. 00:03:59:13 - 00:04:00:23 Unknown Welcome, Toni. 00:04:01:06 - 00:04:02:00 Unknown Thanks, Tim. 00:04:02:00 - 00:04:02:16 Unknown Hi. 00:04:02:23 - 00:04:05:07 Unknown that was kind of an impressive list of 00:04:05:07 - 00:04:07:01 Unknown contacts that I just real time. 00:04:07:01 - 00:04:10:23 Unknown I wonder if you have a favorite thing that you've worked on while you've been at steel? 00:04:10:24 - 00:04:12:10 Unknown I know it's been a long time. 00:04:12:11 - 00:04:22:05 Unknown I think I go through phases. To be honest, it's always the ones that, kind of look at the forefront of my mind that are the ones that that stick, I guess. So, 00:04:22:05 - 00:04:25:24 Unknown I think the Hyperloop One was really interesting because it was very different. 00:04:25:24 - 00:04:28:15 Unknown And it was in India about one year and it 00:04:28:15 - 00:04:29:14 Unknown got kind of canceled. 00:04:29:14 - 00:04:40:08 Unknown The government didn't follow that so that it became nothing. So that that's not as exciting. It's also exciting when you have projects that you work on. And then they come through and they happen. I think this, 00:04:40:08 - 00:04:50:02 Unknown project with CAF is one where, you know, we can see things happening on the ground and press releases and becomes a lot more of a, a real tangible thing that we're studying. 00:04:50:02 - 00:04:58:11 Unknown So, yeah, a huge range basically. But anything that is not that ordinary and means you have to think bit differently is, is why I've enjoyed. 00:04:58:24 - 00:05:00:18 Unknown Yeah. I guess, like 00:05:00:18 - 00:05:05:23 Unknown from your mind to the real world. Must make you feel very powerful. That's. 00:05:05:23 - 00:05:11:11 Unknown Yeah. It's too scary as well. But yeah, but I can take the powerful. 00:05:11:20 - 00:05:12:12 Unknown Nice. 00:05:12:12 - 00:05:14:05 Unknown Thank you. Well, welcome. Both. 00:05:14:05 - 00:05:15:12 Unknown Right. So, 00:05:15:12 - 00:05:23:20 Unknown Meghan, I've given a brief description at the beginning there of corridors, but could you maybe tell us a little bit more about what Carvana is and what you're working on? 00:05:23:23 - 00:05:26:24 Unknown Yeah. Of course. Well, so cab is building, 00:05:26:24 - 00:05:30:08 Unknown smart roads, starting with our flagship project in Michigan, which, 00:05:30:08 - 00:05:31:14 Unknown we'll get into, 00:05:31:14 - 00:05:32:12 Unknown more. But 00:05:32:12 - 00:05:34:12 Unknown foundational to our projects is, 00:05:34:12 - 00:05:38:24 Unknown continuous roadway coverage, meaning we deploy technology poles 00:05:38:24 - 00:05:41:19 Unknown that with sensor pod, compute pod, 00:05:41:19 - 00:05:43:07 Unknown communications technology, 00:05:43:07 - 00:05:47:16 Unknown that basically enables complete understanding of what's happening on the road. 00:05:47:18 - 00:06:01:06 Unknown Every and to hit and, with that understanding, we can identify emerging roadway risks and deliver guidance to drivers, road operators and eventually vehicles about how to navigate 00:06:01:06 - 00:06:01:24 Unknown the road. 00:06:01:24 - 00:06:04:02 Unknown And we're doing this because we see 00:06:04:02 - 00:06:05:16 Unknown persistent challenges in 00:06:05:16 - 00:06:07:16 Unknown real performance and a wave of 00:06:07:16 - 00:06:12:24 Unknown advanced vehicles entering the market, and they're growing in the market. They're here already. 00:06:12:24 - 00:06:22:21 Unknown When we see that crashes and congestion are growing despite massive investments in roads and vehicles, we start looking for what's going to, 00:06:22:21 - 00:06:27:07 Unknown deliver the next step, change in in road performance and 00:06:27:07 - 00:06:28:01 Unknown sense. 00:06:28:01 - 00:06:30:01 Unknown the highway system was built. 00:06:30:01 - 00:06:34:05 Unknown There has been this growing acknowledgment that digital infrastructure has a role to play. 00:06:34:05 - 00:06:37:13 Unknown Intelligent transportation systems are known to be highly effective in, 00:06:37:13 - 00:06:38:12 Unknown reducing 00:06:38:12 - 00:06:40:11 Unknown crashes, congestion and emission 00:06:40:11 - 00:06:41:06 Unknown emissions. But, 00:06:41:06 - 00:06:43:04 Unknown they've been limited by 00:06:43:04 - 00:06:47:09 Unknown the capabilities of technology and the scope of their deployment. 00:06:47:09 - 00:06:54:14 Unknown But now we have made this massive investment in roadside and vehicle connectivity, 00:06:54:14 - 00:07:02:06 Unknown and we have the ability to process just so much more information than we did, you know, ten years ago or even imagined ten years ago. 00:07:02:06 - 00:07:03:09 Unknown Right. And so, 00:07:03:09 - 00:07:09:00 Unknown we with full coverage, I guess I was just foundational to our projects. We can 00:07:09:00 - 00:07:16:15 Unknown start to have an awareness of everything that's happening in the road and build predictive insights around that awareness and start to deliver 00:07:16:15 - 00:07:17:16 Unknown guidance to, 00:07:17:16 - 00:07:18:21 Unknown drivers. So, 00:07:18:21 - 00:07:24:03 Unknown that means we have not only the opportunity to address these persistent road challenges, but, 00:07:24:03 - 00:07:26:14 Unknown equip roads with technology for 00:07:26:14 - 00:07:27:24 Unknown the advanced vehicles coming 00:07:27:24 - 00:07:28:24 Unknown onto them. 00:07:28:24 - 00:07:31:14 Unknown I think, brings us to Michigan, where we have our flagship 00:07:31:14 - 00:07:32:10 Unknown project. 00:07:32:14 - 00:07:33:23 Unknown That was great. Thank you. 00:07:33:23 - 00:07:36:24 Unknown So, really interesting to hear about, 00:07:36:24 - 00:07:38:17 Unknown the road safety concerns. 00:07:38:17 - 00:07:43:19 Unknown So. Yeah. Why don't you tell us a little bit more about the I-94 project and how it operates? 00:07:43:23 - 00:07:45:04 Unknown Yeah. So 00:07:45:04 - 00:07:48:23 Unknown we have a three mile pilot on 94 lives. Now, 00:07:48:23 - 00:07:51:07 Unknown part of a broader deployment, 00:07:51:07 - 00:07:53:01 Unknown between Ann Arbor and Detroit. 00:07:53:01 - 00:07:59:09 Unknown On that three mile stretch, we've upgraded the pavement lighting, 00:07:59:09 - 00:08:03:07 Unknown guardrail and delineation so it looks like an express lane if you've ever 00:08:03:07 - 00:08:04:18 Unknown been in one that has, 00:08:04:18 - 00:08:06:04 Unknown and it feels like that, we've, 00:08:06:04 - 00:08:07:23 Unknown upgraded the pavement so it's 00:08:07:23 - 00:08:10:09 Unknown smooth and no potholes or, 00:08:10:09 - 00:08:12:16 Unknown lane markings are all clear and everything. 00:08:12:16 - 00:08:13:06 Unknown And we've 00:08:13:06 - 00:08:16:00 Unknown added the technology policy described 00:08:16:00 - 00:08:17:17 Unknown every 200m. So we have a salty 00:08:17:17 - 00:08:19:17 Unknown field of view of what's happening on the road. 00:08:19:17 - 00:08:22:02 Unknown And that technology offers 00:08:22:02 - 00:08:26:09 Unknown lane level understanding of road hazards, events, 00:08:26:09 - 00:08:27:00 Unknown traffic. 00:08:27:00 - 00:08:30:14 Unknown And right now our models are training to be able to quickly 00:08:30:14 - 00:08:31:08 Unknown and 00:08:31:08 - 00:08:35:10 Unknown precisely understand what's happening on the roads, exactly where it's happening. 00:08:35:10 - 00:08:40:23 Unknown So that might be hazards like stalled vehicles or debris or vulnerable road users. 00:08:40:23 - 00:08:44:24 Unknown And these insights that we're building are going to translate into guidance for, 00:08:44:24 - 00:08:53:18 Unknown like I said, drivers, vehicles, operators to take more proactive actions to be safer, more efficient, and ultimately with automated driving, 00:08:53:18 - 00:08:54:15 Unknown That's great. So, 00:08:54:15 - 00:08:56:21 Unknown you kind of added on automated driving that 00:08:56:21 - 00:08:59:07 Unknown don't know if this is going to be skipping ahead a little bit, but I thought, 00:08:59:10 - 00:09:01:20 Unknown there will surely be a gap between 00:09:01:20 - 00:09:05:20 Unknown some automation and complete automation. So how will that kind of transition 00:09:05:20 - 00:09:08:24 Unknown work and is managing that transition part of the corridor? 00:09:09:00 - 00:09:10:21 Unknown Yeah. Well, I mean, I think, 00:09:10:21 - 00:09:13:22 Unknown like I said, there's this wave of advanced vehicles coming 00:09:13:22 - 00:09:17:01 Unknown in the market already. Right? And I think where 00:09:17:01 - 00:09:24:19 Unknown road operators that concerned is about we can imagine a completely automated future, and we can imagine now and what's happening in between. 00:09:24:19 - 00:09:28:03 Unknown Is where I think roadway complexity will increase. 00:09:28:03 - 00:09:31:11 Unknown And so having this single source of truth about what's happening 00:09:31:11 - 00:09:33:12 Unknown on the road and being able to 00:09:33:12 - 00:09:37:10 Unknown deliver guidance from a single source of truth to every road user, 00:09:37:10 - 00:09:39:07 Unknown I think will help us navigate that 00:09:39:07 - 00:09:40:20 Unknown transition period. 00:09:40:20 - 00:09:42:14 Unknown You know, it takes a long time for 00:09:42:14 - 00:09:44:09 Unknown vehicle technology to, like, fully 00:09:44:09 - 00:09:47:17 Unknown roll over. So it will be a long time before if, 00:09:47:17 - 00:09:49:24 Unknown if ever, a fully automated future. 00:09:50:01 - 00:09:51:24 Unknown So the cab corridor, 00:09:51:24 - 00:09:53:11 Unknown like I said, right now we're just 00:09:53:11 - 00:09:56:05 Unknown building our insights about what's happening on the road. 00:09:56:05 - 00:09:57:16 Unknown Ultimately, the project will 00:09:57:16 - 00:10:02:07 Unknown convert into a dedicated lane for connected and advanced vehicles. 00:10:02:07 - 00:10:06:05 Unknown And the way that I think about that is that allows, 00:10:06:05 - 00:10:13:17 Unknown early realization of that full automated future. So things like coordinated driving, which, 00:10:13:17 - 00:10:16:20 Unknown really like maximize the throughput of capacity, 00:10:16:20 - 00:10:18:21 Unknown improve safety, all these, 00:10:18:21 - 00:10:22:08 Unknown benefits that we expect to realize in that fully automated future. 00:10:22:08 - 00:10:25:11 Unknown We can get it earlier by concentrating vehicles in the lane. 00:10:25:11 - 00:10:27:12 Unknown And we can learn a lot from that. So, 00:10:27:12 - 00:10:29:16 Unknown I think I answered your question to. 00:10:29:16 - 00:10:34:12 Unknown Yeah. Yeah. And I also gave more of an insight in terms of how, 00:10:34:12 - 00:10:40:18 Unknown as well as being an early rollout, it can act as a sort of like early data gathering exercise, I guess, because it's such a 00:10:40:18 - 00:10:41:13 Unknown smaller, 00:10:41:13 - 00:10:45:20 Unknown thing. Tony, I can see that you're not saying I don't know if you have anything to add about that. 00:10:45:20 - 00:10:46:06 Unknown And how 00:10:46:06 - 00:10:49:01 Unknown useful it might be for companies like steer, especially. 00:10:49:01 - 00:10:52:21 Unknown Yeah. Just nodding away. Really. I think the point that Megan made about, 00:10:52:21 - 00:10:58:09 Unknown people being able to envisage the very far off future of everyone automated versus now 00:10:58:09 - 00:10:59:06 Unknown that middle bit. 00:10:59:06 - 00:11:03:12 Unknown As Megan said, it's not going to be a few years. It's going to be over a long period. 00:11:03:12 - 00:11:07:14 Unknown And it really is the bit that is the most complex and is going to need a lot of 00:11:07:14 - 00:11:09:17 Unknown input from different stakeholders and 00:11:09:17 - 00:11:10:18 Unknown public private. 00:11:10:18 - 00:11:14:03 Unknown Yeah. I think there's a lot of opportunities to really think how to do that 00:11:14:03 - 00:11:15:15 Unknown efficiently and 00:11:15:15 - 00:11:17:03 Unknown as quickly as possible. But 00:11:17:03 - 00:11:18:01 Unknown knowing that it's 00:11:18:01 - 00:11:19:04 Unknown yeah, it's going to be a, 00:11:19:04 - 00:11:19:23 Unknown a long, 00:11:19:23 - 00:11:25:07 Unknown methodical process rather than, you know, waking up tomorrow and, and the roadways have changed. 00:11:25:07 - 00:11:31:15 Unknown Yeah. It seems kind of very close and very far away all at the same time. Now that we're having this conversation, at least, 00:11:31:15 - 00:11:33:00 Unknown Okay. So, 00:11:33:00 - 00:11:33:17 Unknown considering, 00:11:33:17 - 00:11:43:06 Unknown how the corridor will be an improvement to how the highway currently works, I wonder if you could maybe tell us a bit about some specifics. I know we just touched on them in the opening, 00:11:43:06 - 00:11:46:15 Unknown and how the technology will improve the conditions for road users. 00:11:46:19 - 00:11:47:09 Unknown Sure. 00:11:47:09 - 00:11:50:15 Unknown The way I think about this is so much of our 00:11:50:15 - 00:11:55:23 Unknown safety, congestion and reliability challenges are intertwined. I think we've all. 00:11:55:23 - 00:11:56:15 Unknown you drive. 00:11:56:15 - 00:11:56:24 Unknown I think 00:11:56:24 - 00:11:58:06 Unknown you all experienced 00:11:58:06 - 00:12:00:11 Unknown driving down a high speed roadway. 00:12:00:11 - 00:12:02:01 Unknown all of a sudden having to slam on the 00:12:02:01 - 00:12:03:16 Unknown brakes because there's a traffic jam. 00:12:03:16 - 00:12:04:16 Unknown you weren't aware of. 00:12:04:16 - 00:12:05:04 Unknown And 00:12:05:04 - 00:12:07:10 Unknown in these moments, we faced 00:12:07:10 - 00:12:09:06 Unknown not only a real risk of a 00:12:09:06 - 00:12:09:22 Unknown crunch, 00:12:09:22 - 00:12:11:03 Unknown Or a rear end or, 00:12:11:03 - 00:12:12:08 Unknown something dangerous. 00:12:12:08 - 00:12:13:20 Unknown But we also thought we were, 00:12:13:20 - 00:12:20:02 Unknown five minutes away from where we were going, and we see even if we have maps on, you know, we see the time ticking up that, 00:12:20:02 - 00:12:20:21 Unknown so 00:12:20:21 - 00:12:21:24 Unknown our technology will 00:12:21:24 - 00:12:22:20 Unknown allow 00:12:22:20 - 00:12:25:21 Unknown drivers to be aware of these events before approaching them. 00:12:25:21 - 00:12:27:22 Unknown And so we can extend the 00:12:27:22 - 00:12:33:11 Unknown driver of the vehicles response and planning time so they can break sooner, or they can reroute. 00:12:33:11 - 00:12:33:20 Unknown And 00:12:33:20 - 00:12:35:22 Unknown these proactive actions have a real 00:12:35:22 - 00:12:37:24 Unknown impact on really performance. 00:12:37:24 - 00:12:39:10 Unknown Studies have shown that 00:12:39:10 - 00:12:41:20 Unknown really small proportion of vehicles responding to like 00:12:41:20 - 00:12:43:18 Unknown guidance coming through a, 00:12:43:18 - 00:12:47:09 Unknown speed reduction zone stop. Everyone slows down just a little bit earlier, 00:12:47:09 - 00:12:48:19 Unknown can reduce 00:12:48:19 - 00:12:51:09 Unknown the impact of that jam can actually 00:12:51:09 - 00:12:52:19 Unknown slow the fall. 00:12:52:21 - 00:12:56:02 Unknown You know, when you get to, like, a full stop, it can slow that. It can it can, 00:12:56:02 - 00:12:57:14 Unknown prolong the time where we're, 00:12:57:14 - 00:13:02:19 Unknown moving forward. And not that that creates real efficiency benefits for everybody. And so, 00:13:02:19 - 00:13:04:16 Unknown we're trying to effect safety, 00:13:04:16 - 00:13:07:02 Unknown liability, congestion just by knowing what's happening 00:13:07:02 - 00:13:10:01 Unknown on the roads and, and being able to deliver guidance around that. 00:13:10:01 - 00:13:15:10 Unknown And I think what's important for our projects is that guidance comes from a single source of truth about 00:13:15:10 - 00:13:16:15 Unknown what's happening right? 00:13:16:20 - 00:13:19:22 Unknown the events that happen, especially on high speed roads, 00:13:19:22 - 00:13:26:19 Unknown they're not static like debris flies around roads, traffic jams move. Right. And so by having 00:13:26:19 - 00:13:28:24 Unknown a single source of truth about 00:13:28:24 - 00:13:31:09 Unknown what exactly where exactly what, 00:13:31:12 - 00:13:38:15 Unknown we can deliver really specific guidance to the user to, to anybody on the road about how to navigate those things, improving their, 00:13:38:15 - 00:13:39:18 Unknown safety, 00:13:39:18 - 00:13:41:05 Unknown travel times and reliability. 00:13:41:05 - 00:13:41:17 Unknown And 00:13:41:17 - 00:13:43:01 Unknown if I go back to my, 00:13:43:01 - 00:13:45:17 Unknown early illustration about having a slam on the brakes like 00:13:45:17 - 00:13:49:02 Unknown If you've ever experienced that kind of situation while 00:13:49:02 - 00:13:53:13 Unknown you have adaptive cruise control, which kind of helps you navigate slowdowns in traffic, 00:13:53:13 - 00:13:58:21 Unknown you can start to understand why that guidance would be useful to advanced vehicles that are already here. 00:13:59:02 - 00:13:59:24 Unknown Because 00:13:59:24 - 00:14:04:11 Unknown the planning is important not only for drivers but for, 00:14:04:11 - 00:14:05:16 Unknown vehicles, which are, 00:14:05:16 - 00:14:06:12 Unknown managing, 00:14:06:12 - 00:14:08:22 Unknown stop and start or supporting you and stop and start, 00:14:08:22 - 00:14:09:24 Unknown traffic flow. So 00:14:09:24 - 00:14:19:03 Unknown that's two drivers and vehicles on the operational side. There's like a whole host of inefficiencies that we would think dealt don't exist on roads today. 00:14:19:03 - 00:14:21:17 Unknown But they do. And like I said, that's because like 00:14:21:17 - 00:14:23:10 Unknown Broadway events are dynamic. 00:14:23:10 - 00:14:26:19 Unknown Just thinking about like I was driving to work the other day and, 00:14:26:19 - 00:14:27:11 Unknown there was a 00:14:27:11 - 00:14:30:03 Unknown car stalled in the right lane on the freeway and, 00:14:30:03 - 00:14:31:12 Unknown a tow truck moving in 00:14:31:12 - 00:14:32:07 Unknown and 00:14:32:07 - 00:14:33:00 Unknown a dynamic 00:14:33:00 - 00:14:36:06 Unknown massive sign had said, like, right lanes blocked, you know, because 00:14:36:06 - 00:14:37:20 Unknown well, as I drove by, it, 00:14:37:20 - 00:14:41:00 Unknown the tow truck moved the vehicle into the, 00:14:41:00 - 00:14:41:13 Unknown shoulder. 00:14:41:13 - 00:14:42:20 Unknown And so now the right lane is 00:14:42:20 - 00:14:44:02 Unknown not blocked. 00:14:44:02 - 00:14:44:21 Unknown Which 00:14:44:21 - 00:14:54:10 Unknown if you knew exactly what was happening, you could change that information really quickly. And that doesn't that just doesn't happen as much on roads, because we don't have that insight. 00:14:54:10 - 00:14:55:09 Unknown And, 00:14:55:13 - 00:14:57:14 Unknown with full understanding. I think 00:14:57:14 - 00:14:59:24 Unknown the operations and maintenance tasks will get a lot 00:14:59:24 - 00:15:03:12 Unknown better, more proactive, faster and safer for people. 00:15:03:12 - 00:15:06:17 Unknown So a phrase that I've used a couple of times that I maybe want to try and 00:15:06:17 - 00:15:07:18 Unknown unpack is, 00:15:07:18 - 00:15:09:09 Unknown a single source of truth. 00:15:09:09 - 00:15:11:00 Unknown So what does that 00:15:11:00 - 00:15:11:11 Unknown mean? 00:15:11:11 - 00:15:12:09 Unknown Yeah. 00:15:12:09 - 00:15:14:18 Unknown Well, a lot of the information off roads 00:15:14:18 - 00:15:15:18 Unknown now is, 00:15:15:18 - 00:15:16:23 Unknown outsourced. 00:15:16:23 - 00:15:17:19 Unknown Right. So, 00:15:17:19 - 00:15:18:24 Unknown I don't use 00:15:18:24 - 00:15:22:23 Unknown Waze, but at one point when I was using Waze, it was like, is that 00:15:22:23 - 00:15:25:18 Unknown crash still here? And I would have to click, oh, that was driving. 00:15:25:18 - 00:15:26:20 Unknown Yes, it's still here. 00:15:26:20 - 00:15:28:05 Unknown Right now it's not still there. 00:15:28:05 - 00:15:31:18 Unknown And so everyone's responding to that little bit differently. 00:15:31:18 - 00:15:35:10 Unknown Some crowdsource data comes from vehicles themselves. Right. 00:15:35:10 - 00:15:36:00 Unknown But 00:15:36:00 - 00:15:37:12 Unknown what's happening is 00:15:37:12 - 00:15:40:06 Unknown is all this sort of individual, 00:15:40:06 - 00:15:44:16 Unknown information being gathered about the roads. I actually heard someone else describe this. 00:15:44:16 - 00:15:46:08 Unknown In a useful way. I thought, 00:15:46:08 - 00:15:49:08 Unknown traffic jams, like, we think they're static because 00:15:49:08 - 00:15:50:23 Unknown we hit them in one place, and then we stop. 00:15:50:23 - 00:15:55:10 Unknown But they're actually moving backwards. Like, it's like a shockwave when the traffic jam happens, 00:15:55:13 - 00:15:59:12 Unknown And you'll notice if you have like a mapping software that has like the colors about 00:15:59:12 - 00:16:04:07 Unknown where you're going to hit red, which is a quick stop. It's almost never accurate to like 00:16:04:07 - 00:16:05:02 Unknown where 00:16:05:02 - 00:16:10:03 Unknown you actually red, where you have to stop because it's a moving thing. 00:16:10:03 - 00:16:12:14 Unknown so there's always going to be some delay with, 00:16:12:14 - 00:16:15:08 Unknown crowdsourced data, be it from drivers or vehicles, 00:16:15:08 - 00:16:15:18 Unknown To 00:16:15:18 - 00:16:18:15 Unknown where the jam actually is. And, 00:16:18:15 - 00:16:23:23 Unknown That's what we have now. It's crowdsourced data. There are cameras on roads like their CCTV cameras, but they're 00:16:23:23 - 00:16:24:14 Unknown sparse. 00:16:24:14 - 00:16:25:10 Unknown Right. And so, 00:16:25:10 - 00:16:28:01 Unknown what our sensors will do, well, 00:16:28:01 - 00:16:29:01 Unknown give you, 00:16:29:01 - 00:16:32:08 Unknown one view, like one source about where everything is, 00:16:32:08 - 00:16:33:09 Unknown and 00:16:33:09 - 00:16:36:08 Unknown how quickly traffic jams are moving and 00:16:36:08 - 00:16:37:21 Unknown where events are on the road. 00:16:37:21 - 00:16:40:10 Unknown So that's what I mean by single source of truth. 00:16:40:10 - 00:16:43:14 Unknown it's. So it gathers the system, will gather all the 00:16:43:14 - 00:16:47:07 Unknown contemporaneously the information into one thing, and then feedback to the drivers. 00:16:47:14 - 00:16:48:22 Unknown Yeah, yeah. 00:16:48:22 - 00:16:52:02 Unknown To drivers or operators. 00:16:52:15 - 00:17:01:17 Unknown guess the really key thing here is that everybody on that corridor has the exact same information. So it's not one person seeing one thing. Another person responding in a different way. 00:17:01:17 - 00:17:06:14 Unknown And also, Megan, because the corridor will have the full picture of the information, 00:17:06:14 - 00:17:12:07 Unknown I guess. I hope what it can do is the thing that really frustrates me is actually be able to do a bit of 00:17:12:07 - 00:17:14:13 Unknown short term forecasting and tell you, you know, 00:17:14:13 - 00:17:16:13 Unknown what will the delays be like in a few minutes time? 00:17:16:13 - 00:17:20:12 Unknown Not one minute ago, which is what always frustrates me with those 00:17:20:12 - 00:17:21:24 Unknown red bits on the map. I'm like, 00:17:21:24 - 00:17:25:24 Unknown Why don't you think about where that red bits going to be when I get there? Not not right now. 00:17:25:24 - 00:17:29:09 Unknown And that because that calf corridor is completely controlled environment, 00:17:29:09 - 00:17:32:08 Unknown it will have that ability to really see 00:17:32:08 - 00:17:32:16 Unknown the 00:17:32:16 - 00:17:33:13 Unknown full journey, 00:17:33:13 - 00:17:36:04 Unknown yeah. And I think one thing that I probably haven't 00:17:36:04 - 00:17:37:06 Unknown stressed enough, which is 00:17:37:06 - 00:17:38:15 Unknown reporting, and it's 00:17:38:15 - 00:17:42:14 Unknown we have the level understanding of what's happening, which, 00:17:42:14 - 00:17:44:07 Unknown that's not really exists today. 00:17:44:07 - 00:17:45:21 Unknown Especially on highways like, 00:17:45:21 - 00:17:49:18 Unknown you know, there's debris in the road and that's causing. And I'm you'll see, 00:17:49:18 - 00:17:53:13 Unknown orange or red or whatever on your map, but you don't know until you get there 00:17:53:13 - 00:17:55:05 Unknown that you should have been that lane anymore. 00:17:55:05 - 00:17:55:22 Unknown Right. And so 00:17:55:22 - 00:17:57:00 Unknown those types of, 00:17:57:00 - 00:18:00:20 Unknown predictive to your point, Tony, predictive, but also very precise, 00:18:00:20 - 00:18:02:07 Unknown guidance about how to navigate, 00:18:02:07 - 00:18:05:02 Unknown especially these roads that are high speed. Right. Because 00:18:05:02 - 00:18:05:23 Unknown depending on, 00:18:05:23 - 00:18:06:24 Unknown the capacity of 00:18:06:24 - 00:18:11:13 Unknown the volumes, the capacity in the road and at that point, any type of like inefficient, 00:18:11:13 - 00:18:15:00 Unknown movement can really have a serious effect on what happens behind you. 00:18:15:00 - 00:18:16:24 Unknown And so again, like this, 00:18:16:24 - 00:18:18:02 Unknown everyone having 00:18:18:02 - 00:18:19:10 Unknown the same guidance, 00:18:19:10 - 00:18:21:22 Unknown for how to navigate through these situations can, 00:18:21:22 - 00:18:23:02 Unknown well, play create better, 00:18:23:02 - 00:18:24:04 Unknown environment for everybody. 00:18:24:08 - 00:18:26:03 Unknown Yeah. That really makes a lot of sense. 00:18:26:03 - 00:18:27:06 Unknown And then 00:18:27:06 - 00:18:36:18 Unknown I guess also, it will. Might sound obvious. Just improve people's quality of life quite a lot. Because I imagine if you are regularly driving, 00:18:36:18 - 00:18:38:07 Unknown unstuck in traffic, 00:18:38:07 - 00:18:38:14 Unknown it's. 00:18:38:14 - 00:18:39:00 Unknown Not 00:18:39:13 - 00:18:40:14 Unknown Yeah. I think, 00:18:40:14 - 00:18:44:06 Unknown I think the average driver in the US, us like 50 hours a year 00:18:44:06 - 00:18:45:04 Unknown to congestion. 00:18:45:04 - 00:18:45:21 Unknown And, 00:18:45:21 - 00:18:47:06 Unknown giving people time back 00:18:47:06 - 00:18:49:01 Unknown is such a huge, 00:18:49:01 - 00:18:51:14 Unknown quality of life improvement. To your point, Tim. 00:18:51:14 - 00:18:55:17 Unknown And doing so and, like I said, we're stressing safety, like doing so in a safe way, 00:18:56:06 - 00:19:00:16 Unknown with regards to the work that cabinet and staff have been doing together, 00:19:00:16 - 00:19:01:13 Unknown can 00:19:01:13 - 00:19:04:16 Unknown you offer an overview of the project that we worked on? 00:19:04:20 - 00:19:05:20 Unknown Yeah. So, 00:19:05:20 - 00:19:08:04 Unknown I'll let Tony speak to this as well, but, 00:19:08:04 - 00:19:09:20 Unknown we worked with steer to 00:19:09:20 - 00:19:10:08 Unknown develop 00:19:10:08 - 00:19:15:12 Unknown what I believe is the first planning level study for a cab corridor in the United States. 00:19:15:12 - 00:19:18:12 Unknown So that's a traffic and revenue study, 00:19:18:12 - 00:19:22:11 Unknown where we really focused on understanding the value of, 00:19:22:11 - 00:19:24:07 Unknown automated driving to 00:19:24:07 - 00:19:25:09 Unknown Michigan drivers. 00:19:25:09 - 00:19:26:04 Unknown so 00:19:26:04 - 00:19:27:01 Unknown much like any 00:19:27:01 - 00:19:29:03 Unknown planning level, traffic and revenue study, alleged, 00:19:29:03 - 00:19:31:14 Unknown Tony, speak to all the fun stuff about, 00:19:31:14 - 00:19:39:19 Unknown network models and whatnot. But I think what's interesting about this project is that autonomy aspect, about what it means for people to, 00:19:39:19 - 00:19:43:17 Unknown have time back in their vehicle. So if your vehicle's hindering the driving 00:19:43:17 - 00:19:46:19 Unknown task for you, what can you do and how do you value that 00:19:46:19 - 00:19:47:03 Unknown time? 00:19:47:03 - 00:19:48:19 Unknown It's different than the time you get, like 00:19:48:19 - 00:19:51:04 Unknown if you get somewhere earlier, right? So, 00:19:51:04 - 00:19:52:19 Unknown we did a lot of 00:19:52:19 - 00:20:00:14 Unknown primary research. We surveyed drivers, I did academic studies and really like grappled with how drivers think about, 00:20:00:14 - 00:20:02:06 Unknown time they spend in their vehicle, 00:20:02:06 - 00:20:04:10 Unknown and what it might look like to have some of that time back. 00:20:04:10 - 00:20:05:12 Unknown Tony, do you want to, 00:20:05:12 - 00:20:07:22 Unknown speak to any of that research that we've done? 00:20:07:22 - 00:20:08:08 Unknown Yeah. 00:20:08:08 - 00:20:10:23 Unknown We held focus groups to understand how 00:20:10:23 - 00:20:13:10 Unknown people perceive these corridors. I mean, you know, 00:20:13:10 - 00:20:13:21 Unknown for us 00:20:13:21 - 00:20:14:18 Unknown talking today, 00:20:14:18 - 00:20:19:00 Unknown we talked about cow corridors a lot, Megan. It's her whole job talking about this. 00:20:19:00 - 00:20:23:07 Unknown So for us it's this it's very familiar. For some people they're like what? Like 00:20:23:07 - 00:20:26:02 Unknown what would I be doing in the how would that work? And, 00:20:26:02 - 00:20:31:01 Unknown you know, maybe slightly kind of apprehensive because that's different to how things are now. So, 00:20:31:01 - 00:20:39:01 Unknown you know, we had to do a lot of work talking with people, understanding how they perceive this and how to really communicate the benefits to get past that initial, 00:20:39:01 - 00:20:42:01 Unknown oh, this is different to what it might be like for them in 00:20:42:01 - 00:20:46:15 Unknown when they could actually use the corridor, and that's a real option for them and in their vehicle. 00:20:46:15 - 00:20:51:14 Unknown So the first bit was the focus groups. We then needed to design an online survey to really 00:20:51:14 - 00:20:52:13 Unknown not only 00:20:52:13 - 00:20:56:12 Unknown get some basic information about their journey, but also try and 00:20:56:12 - 00:21:01:20 Unknown get them to share with us what might make them was saying, what value they would put on this kind of a corridor. 00:21:01:20 - 00:21:02:11 Unknown So 00:21:02:11 - 00:21:03:07 Unknown really trying 00:21:03:07 - 00:21:07:09 Unknown to give them choices and to ask questions in a way that means that 00:21:07:09 - 00:21:08:11 Unknown we can estimate 00:21:08:11 - 00:21:10:13 Unknown how they would value this corridor 00:21:10:13 - 00:21:11:14 Unknown compared to, say, 00:21:11:14 - 00:21:15:17 Unknown a normal express lane or, you know, just a normal highway. 00:21:15:17 - 00:21:20:21 Unknown A how much more value it would give them. But equally, you know, would they be prepared to pay for that 00:21:20:21 - 00:21:21:13 Unknown extra 00:21:21:13 - 00:21:24:00 Unknown value? And how much and how would that work? 00:21:24:00 - 00:21:24:19 Unknown So a lot of, 00:21:24:19 - 00:21:26:19 Unknown our focus was really in, first of all, 00:21:26:19 - 00:21:31:09 Unknown working out how to explain this to someone that might not be too aware of it and not overwhelming them. 00:21:31:09 - 00:21:31:23 Unknown And then 00:21:31:23 - 00:21:37:04 Unknown really trying to get in that situation. How would you value this and and what value would you 00:21:37:04 - 00:21:38:15 Unknown put on these corridors? 00:21:38:15 - 00:21:39:11 Unknown And then comes 00:21:39:11 - 00:21:43:12 Unknown the less exciting part where we then have to put all the numbers together and 00:21:43:12 - 00:21:50:11 Unknown prepare a forecast and really, you know, look, a lot of scenarios to understand what the impact of this corridor would be and, and who would use it 00:21:50:11 - 00:21:52:16 Unknown with all of that information that we've got from 00:21:52:16 - 00:21:53:24 Unknown the primary research. 00:21:54:03 - 00:21:56:13 Unknown So, how long have we been working on this? 00:21:56:13 - 00:21:56:23 Unknown say two 00:21:57:10 - 00:21:59:08 Unknown Think two year is our. 00:21:59:11 - 00:22:01:11 Unknown it's just interesting. Because you're kind of 00:22:01:11 - 00:22:11:00 Unknown working with something that essentially doesn't quite exist. Yeah. So, like, is there a cumulative or do you expect that to be a cumulative effect of 00:22:11:00 - 00:22:18:15 Unknown the roll out on the data since we've started? Have you seen like a maybe even in the time that we've been working with people, have you seen like a shift in attitudes? 00:22:18:15 - 00:22:27:20 Unknown well, I find it quite hard to answer this question without being biased, because I feel like, obviously, I have learned a lot more about these corridors and tried to separate that from 00:22:27:20 - 00:22:29:12 Unknown the average person on the street. 00:22:29:12 - 00:22:29:23 Unknown think 00:22:29:23 - 00:22:35:15 Unknown like Megan was saying at the beginning, there has been more of a rollout of these vehicles and vehicles that can do more and more for you. 00:22:35:15 - 00:22:37:07 Unknown So I think there is a bit more of a 00:22:37:07 - 00:22:39:18 Unknown comfort level for some people of, you know, 00:22:39:18 - 00:22:40:06 Unknown I let my 00:22:40:06 - 00:22:43:02 Unknown vehicle park for me or use cruise control, etc., 00:22:43:02 - 00:22:45:01 Unknown but I think it's probably a lot slower than 00:22:45:01 - 00:22:45:18 Unknown our 00:22:45:18 - 00:22:47:00 Unknown knowledge about these things 00:22:47:00 - 00:22:47:08 Unknown and 00:22:47:08 - 00:22:50:23 Unknown how much more expertise we have now compared to two years ago, compared to, 00:22:50:23 - 00:22:56:03 Unknown the person on the street, the may or may not have a new vehicle in those two years, I would say I don't know. 00:22:56:03 - 00:23:01:10 Unknown Megan, do you feel the same in your bubble? It is quite hard to look outside that. 00:23:01:12 - 00:23:03:06 Unknown Well, Yeah, I think 00:23:03:06 - 00:23:06:08 Unknown I think that's well said, Tony, for, So we have 00:23:06:08 - 00:23:14:01 Unknown parts of the I-94 pilot operational now, and for the people that we speak to in the like transportation you can system, 00:23:14:01 - 00:23:17:04 Unknown that's huge. Because it's real. And, 00:23:17:04 - 00:23:18:16 Unknown people can start to imagine 00:23:18:16 - 00:23:19:10 Unknown how they would 00:23:19:10 - 00:23:20:00 Unknown use that. 00:23:20:00 - 00:23:21:16 Unknown So we hope 00:23:21:16 - 00:23:23:22 Unknown that, that starts to build an understanding. 00:23:23:22 - 00:23:27:01 Unknown Just having a project I 94 it's short. It's three months. 00:23:27:01 - 00:23:27:13 Unknown But, 00:23:27:13 - 00:23:29:03 Unknown it's real fun. So, 00:23:29:03 - 00:23:33:21 Unknown I think to Tony's point, though, there are there are layers to this that, 00:23:33:21 - 00:23:34:17 Unknown are atypical 00:23:34:17 - 00:23:36:10 Unknown for TNR studies, 00:23:36:10 - 00:23:37:08 Unknown because 00:23:37:08 - 00:23:40:01 Unknown there is a vehicle technology component which 00:23:40:01 - 00:23:42:18 Unknown you don't have any vehicle, you kind of have to imagine. 00:23:42:18 - 00:23:45:00 Unknown And then there's that vehicle in the lane, 00:23:45:00 - 00:23:45:17 Unknown which 00:23:45:17 - 00:23:50:08 Unknown then is another step of having to imagine. And so I think a lot of the work that steer did 00:23:50:08 - 00:23:52:10 Unknown was trying to, 00:23:52:10 - 00:23:56:07 Unknown first of all, explain in a clear way to the average driver what 00:23:56:07 - 00:23:57:05 Unknown a cab corridor 00:23:57:05 - 00:23:57:23 Unknown will be. 00:23:57:23 - 00:24:00:22 Unknown And then second of all, trying to sort through the, 00:24:00:22 - 00:24:03:22 Unknown uncertainty in any type of survey about 00:24:03:22 - 00:24:04:21 Unknown future 00:24:04:21 - 00:24:06:06 Unknown technology or environment. 00:24:06:06 - 00:24:06:14 Unknown To 00:24:06:14 - 00:24:08:11 Unknown deliver meaningful insights about, 00:24:08:11 - 00:24:10:09 Unknown what might happen in five, ten, 00:24:10:09 - 00:24:11:10 Unknown 30 years. 00:24:11:10 - 00:24:12:01 Unknown So 00:24:12:01 - 00:24:18:13 Unknown I think that back to what Tony likes about our work. I think that we take some of the boxes for what, 00:24:18:13 - 00:24:19:02 Unknown teams are 00:24:19:02 - 00:24:22:02 Unknown what is it? Your brain colors. What you say? 00:24:23:00 - 00:24:25:17 Unknown So, yeah, a really interesting project. 00:24:25:17 - 00:24:26:05 Unknown And, 00:24:26:05 - 00:24:29:21 Unknown as we, as we get more and more insights from the corridor, 00:24:29:21 - 00:24:31:08 Unknown that will help improve 00:24:31:08 - 00:24:32:09 Unknown our understanding of, 00:24:32:09 - 00:24:34:17 Unknown how people will use it and how they might value it. 00:24:35:01 - 00:24:36:07 Unknown It's an interesting 00:24:36:07 - 00:24:40:22 Unknown point that, like, obviously automated vehicles and connected automaker vehicles. 00:24:40:22 - 00:24:42:18 Unknown Sounds so futuristic. 00:24:42:18 - 00:24:51:20 Unknown I mean, I appreciate probably not to you my estimate because you like working with it all the time, but, like. But actually, when you think about the science of forecasting, if I can call it that, 00:24:51:20 - 00:24:54:01 Unknown it's into the case where you're like figuring out 00:24:54:01 - 00:24:56:14 Unknown just kind of another new thing, even though 00:24:56:14 - 00:24:58:02 Unknown perhaps it sounds slightly more. 00:24:58:02 - 00:25:01:03 Unknown Although I guess you worked on the Hyperloop, which also sounds 00:25:01:03 - 00:25:03:02 Unknown very futuristic. 00:25:03:02 - 00:25:04:04 Unknown with. To be honest. I mean, 00:25:04:04 - 00:25:10:04 Unknown lots of our forecasting that we do for investment. It's over over decades, you know, sometimes over the next 00:25:10:16 - 00:25:12:00 Unknown 70 years. So, 00:25:12:00 - 00:25:16:14 Unknown yeah, it's not happening next year, but it's definitely happening in the horizon of, 00:25:16:14 - 00:25:22:13 Unknown investors and, and the decision making that investors are making. So yeah, it's something we're having to think about more and more. 00:25:22:13 - 00:25:26:07 Unknown And yeah, this there's more and more information and thinking going into 00:25:26:07 - 00:25:27:00 Unknown what impact 00:25:27:00 - 00:25:28:02 Unknown caps will have 00:25:28:02 - 00:25:39:01 Unknown and kind of with, with two angles. One is the angle of cash. And you really being very proactive in making that investment, to give people the opportunities early on. And then the other is that more long, 00:25:39:01 - 00:25:40:05 Unknown horizon where, 00:25:40:05 - 00:25:45:20 Unknown we just wait for the fleet to naturally turn over, and then there will be impacts of having caps in 00:25:45:20 - 00:25:48:06 Unknown in the vehicle fleet in the much longer term. 00:25:48:10 - 00:25:54:22 Unknown So we're, we're thinking about both in lots of our TNR studies. This is the one like Megan said, it's the first one the 00:25:54:22 - 00:25:57:09 Unknown that we're working on where we're really thinking about, 00:25:57:09 - 00:26:01:10 Unknown what's happening and quite immediate impacts of the investments in 00:26:01:10 - 00:26:02:09 Unknown in having to structure. 00:26:02:09 - 00:26:03:11 Unknown in terms of, 00:26:03:11 - 00:26:03:24 Unknown public. 00:26:03:24 - 00:26:04:15 Unknown I assume 00:26:04:15 - 00:26:11:10 Unknown there'll be people buying new cabs, and then there'll be an element while you're waiting for those to filter down into the second hand market. Right? 00:26:11:10 - 00:26:12:10 Unknown Because most of 00:26:12:10 - 00:26:13:22 Unknown models are second hand, aren't they? 00:26:13:22 - 00:26:14:15 Unknown So 00:26:14:15 - 00:26:16:22 Unknown do you factor in like public take up of 00:26:16:22 - 00:26:20:17 Unknown cars? Obviously you must have to at some point. But like, is that just a natural assumption that 00:26:20:17 - 00:26:29:10 Unknown it will eventually all be cards? Or are you thinking some people might purposefully not want to buy them? And that would be a factor in forecasting. 00:26:29:10 - 00:26:33:20 Unknown so there's a lot in there, like when new models enter the fleet with what features? 00:26:33:20 - 00:26:37:20 Unknown And then of course, how quickly vehicles without that technology are retired. 00:26:37:20 - 00:26:43:07 Unknown And through that work, we know that we're going to be in a mixed environment with cabs and non cabs for a really long time. 00:26:43:07 - 00:26:49:00 Unknown As you get further and further out into a forecast, you are of course confronted with increasing levels of uncertainty. 00:26:49:02 - 00:26:54:23 Unknown It's hard to say what will happen then 50, 60, 70 years. And Tony knows this quite well. But 00:26:54:23 - 00:27:07:13 Unknown many people talk about this fully autonomous future. We just don't see that happening in our forecast. We see supply and demand side constraints to reaching this scenario where every car is driving around handspring. 00:27:07:13 - 00:27:11:09 Unknown and what we're thinking about is how to maximize the system benefits of these vehicles. 00:27:11:09 - 00:27:13:07 Unknown Given the likely scenario that there are always 00:27:13:07 - 00:27:16:02 Unknown less advanced vehicles operating alongside them. 00:27:16:14 - 00:27:17:01 Unknown what? 00:27:17:01 - 00:27:19:07 Unknown Personally for you as a project, 00:27:19:07 - 00:27:19:23 Unknown was 00:27:19:23 - 00:27:23:16 Unknown insightful or what was something new that you learned while you were doing it? 00:27:23:16 - 00:27:24:12 Unknown I guess for me, 00:27:24:12 - 00:27:27:23 Unknown the really interesting and challenging part of this project has been 00:27:27:23 - 00:27:32:11 Unknown the bit I was talking about about really getting people to think about this future, 00:27:32:11 - 00:27:32:18 Unknown and 00:27:32:18 - 00:27:33:18 Unknown the average person 00:27:33:18 - 00:27:36:00 Unknown what it would mean for them to have a calf corridor. 00:27:36:04 - 00:27:36:17 Unknown And I think 00:27:36:17 - 00:27:41:10 Unknown as often with surveys, you go out thinking, oh, yeah, I'll just I'll just put this and it will work. 00:27:41:10 - 00:27:43:03 Unknown But it's never that simple. And 00:27:43:03 - 00:27:50:17 Unknown people always have that prejudice or previous experience or, you know, you don't quite explain something in the way of what they're thinking. 00:27:50:17 - 00:27:51:11 Unknown So, 00:27:51:11 - 00:27:56:14 Unknown as with every survey projects, I've done a new round of learnings on how to explain 00:27:56:14 - 00:27:57:18 Unknown things to people. And, 00:27:57:19 - 00:28:05:06 Unknown you know, you're expecting something quite complicated. You need to keep it simple, but you also need to be reassuring and not leave too much ambiguity, because then 00:28:05:06 - 00:28:08:10 Unknown they fill the gap, maybe with things that you don't want them to be thinking, 00:28:08:10 - 00:28:10:09 Unknown so really that challenge of trying to 00:28:10:09 - 00:28:15:15 Unknown explain what this future situation is that we want them to think about and then, you know, 00:28:15:15 - 00:28:16:07 Unknown unpicking 00:28:16:07 - 00:28:17:18 Unknown how they would behave and, 00:28:17:18 - 00:28:22:08 Unknown really exploring that with real people who have all of their own experiences. 00:28:22:08 - 00:28:23:18 Unknown And really trying to, yeah, 00:28:23:18 - 00:28:25:13 Unknown take that information and then 00:28:25:13 - 00:28:30:14 Unknown put that into a forecast that's going to give us, you know, good, robust, insightful forecasts and 00:28:30:14 - 00:28:32:09 Unknown support avenue in how they're, 00:28:32:09 - 00:28:34:15 Unknown developing the corridors and thinking about things 00:28:34:15 - 00:28:35:19 Unknown that's a huge challenge 00:28:35:19 - 00:28:36:02 Unknown and 00:28:36:02 - 00:28:36:22 Unknown continues 00:28:36:22 - 00:28:37:09 Unknown to be 00:28:37:09 - 00:28:38:11 Unknown the key challenge in 00:28:38:11 - 00:28:39:04 Unknown in our work. 00:28:39:04 - 00:28:40:17 Unknown And when we need to explain it, 00:28:40:17 - 00:28:43:00 Unknown because it's really the, the new part of the, 00:28:43:00 - 00:28:43:22 Unknown the scope. 00:28:43:24 - 00:28:45:04 Unknown That was great. Thank you. 00:28:45:04 - 00:28:46:00 Unknown Tony, 00:28:46:00 - 00:28:51:19 Unknown we've talked a lot about, like, cab news project being new and something that people have to imagine. 00:28:51:19 - 00:28:54:00 Unknown conceptually, because it doesn't exist yet. Right. 00:28:54:00 - 00:28:55:07 Unknown Would you say that 00:28:55:07 - 00:28:57:09 Unknown that element of 00:28:57:09 - 00:28:58:22 Unknown what you just described about 00:28:58:22 - 00:29:00:15 Unknown helping people picture something 00:29:00:15 - 00:29:01:19 Unknown that doesn't exist is 00:29:01:19 - 00:29:02:18 Unknown present in most 00:29:02:18 - 00:29:03:19 Unknown surveys? 00:29:03:24 - 00:29:05:01 Unknown it's normally the reason 00:29:05:01 - 00:29:09:03 Unknown we started looking at investments, do surveys. It's always when this 00:29:09:03 - 00:29:09:21 Unknown something 00:29:09:21 - 00:29:10:13 Unknown new that 00:29:10:13 - 00:29:13:19 Unknown You can't look at how someone behaved because you don't have that 00:29:13:19 - 00:29:14:12 Unknown insight. 00:29:14:12 - 00:29:19:09 Unknown that's when we know we need to do a survey, basically, because there's no other way of knowing how people 00:29:19:09 - 00:29:20:07 Unknown are going to behave. 00:29:20:07 - 00:29:25:19 Unknown You can guess, but you then you miss all of those nuances that I was talking about. The whole process of going through the survey 00:29:25:19 - 00:29:27:02 Unknown helps you to really think 00:29:27:02 - 00:29:29:01 Unknown what what is important to people. 00:29:29:01 - 00:29:35:13 Unknown Yeah, we've talked a lot. About what? Like the first survey is for manage lanes look like in the US when people couldn't 00:29:35:13 - 00:29:37:01 Unknown imagine being able to 00:29:37:01 - 00:29:45:16 Unknown pay to go somewhere faster next to people who work pay said I inch fact like so this is this is something that the industry 00:29:45:16 - 00:29:47:15 Unknown continuous cycle was worth. 00:29:47:15 - 00:29:51:03 Unknown so there are some things I think Tony, having done so many, 00:29:51:03 - 00:29:52:04 Unknown unique projects, 00:29:52:04 - 00:29:54:06 Unknown the right person should be doing that, 00:29:54:06 - 00:29:56:07 Unknown because there there are certainly learnings that 00:29:56:07 - 00:29:57:00 Unknown when I, 00:29:57:00 - 00:30:00:07 Unknown you bring in to, to our project and then, of course, there are things that, 00:30:00:07 - 00:30:04:24 Unknown are new and hopefully exciting for us, hopefully exciting to, to 00:30:04:24 - 00:30:05:13 Unknown study. 00:30:05:23 - 00:30:08:13 Unknown But. Yeah. No. Definitely new. And I think that's what I meant with 00:30:08:13 - 00:30:09:05 Unknown this. Just 00:30:09:05 - 00:30:15:01 Unknown every time you do surveys, you learn something different. Yeah. With the managed lanes, it was all about the fact that people just can't. 00:30:15:01 - 00:30:24:01 Unknown Still, nobody believes how much someone would be willing to pay. Just just to save a few minutes on that given day is a very difficult thing to to pitch somewhere in the survey. 00:30:24:01 - 00:30:24:11 Unknown But 00:30:24:11 - 00:30:25:03 Unknown now, 00:30:25:03 - 00:30:32:13 Unknown in all the express lanes across the US, we see that behavior. I don't think still we could design a survey that would really get at that. It was, 00:30:32:13 - 00:30:36:15 Unknown we refined it, but now we have the real information. We we don't need the survey. 00:30:36:15 - 00:30:42:20 Unknown Similarly with with high speed rail lines, I think that's the other challenge in the US is really understanding how people will behave 00:30:42:20 - 00:30:45:12 Unknown when that transit option is more like, 00:30:45:12 - 00:30:49:11 Unknown like a flight and, and like an air option rather than the typical 00:30:49:11 - 00:30:51:17 Unknown transit services that people might be 00:30:51:17 - 00:30:52:13 Unknown familiar with. 00:30:52:13 - 00:30:58:07 Unknown And really trying to get at that and breaking down some of those biases that maybe people have inherent. 00:30:58:22 - 00:30:59:17 Unknown And I think 00:30:59:17 - 00:31:00:23 Unknown in all of this, like, 00:31:00:23 - 00:31:03:11 Unknown context really matters, right? Like, 00:31:03:11 - 00:31:04:02 Unknown I don't know, 00:31:04:02 - 00:31:05:04 Unknown I've described 00:31:05:04 - 00:31:06:02 Unknown bringing my, 00:31:06:02 - 00:31:06:23 Unknown son to, 00:31:06:23 - 00:31:12:21 Unknown his pediatrician and driving home, and he's, like, screaming in the backseat. And I would pay any amount of money to get a house like 00:31:12:21 - 00:31:16:03 Unknown three minutes faster with a crying baby in the car, you know, 00:31:16:07 - 00:31:18:06 Unknown of course, that's different on a different day. 00:31:18:06 - 00:31:18:22 Unknown And so, 00:31:18:22 - 00:31:22:07 Unknown surveys, I think, are really valuable as an initial, 00:31:22:07 - 00:31:27:08 Unknown kind of check on how people are thinking about things. And then we have to we even know things about 00:31:27:08 - 00:31:28:15 Unknown the context in which 00:31:28:15 - 00:31:29:17 Unknown people drive. 00:31:29:17 - 00:31:31:07 Unknown And travel today. And so, 00:31:31:07 - 00:31:34:10 Unknown that's where some of these other learnings, like Tony said from 00:31:34:10 - 00:31:36:05 Unknown high speed rail, Hyperloop, 00:31:36:05 - 00:31:38:14 Unknown managed lanes, I think are really valuable. 00:31:38:14 - 00:31:38:18 Unknown And 00:31:38:18 - 00:31:39:13 Unknown then, 00:31:39:13 - 00:31:41:24 Unknown a good challenge to work. Let's start. 00:31:42:06 - 00:31:43:03 Unknown Thank you, thank you. 00:31:43:03 - 00:31:46:01 Unknown I guess my last question before we move on to the final section is, 00:31:46:01 - 00:31:49:13 Unknown driving is. That's like a personal thing that people often do 00:31:49:13 - 00:31:50:11 Unknown alone. 00:31:50:11 - 00:31:54:09 Unknown how does that play into the kind of like info gathering we've been talking about? 00:31:54:09 - 00:31:57:22 Unknown Yeah. I mean, everyone's driving experience is different. 00:31:57:22 - 00:31:59:21 Unknown I mean, in the case of the 00:31:59:21 - 00:32:04:18 Unknown AV cap corridors. Right. Like, some people are really excited about new technology coming on in vehicles, 00:32:04:18 - 00:32:06:03 Unknown and some people don't want it, 00:32:06:03 - 00:32:07:01 Unknown like, so they 00:32:07:01 - 00:32:08:06 Unknown don't want it at all. 00:32:08:06 - 00:32:09:14 Unknown And so 00:32:09:14 - 00:32:10:14 Unknown I think 00:32:10:14 - 00:32:14:06 Unknown one thing that's great about the approach that steered AV for this project was, 00:32:14:06 - 00:32:15:15 Unknown the focus groups, 00:32:15:15 - 00:32:20:21 Unknown and the survey we did, because you could kind of get a little more into people's heads with the focus groups. 00:32:20:21 - 00:32:23:13 Unknown gives color to the responses you're getting later about like, 00:32:23:13 - 00:32:24:19 Unknown you know, if people 00:32:24:19 - 00:32:29:18 Unknown always want to use the lane, no matter what the situation is, they're never want to use lane, no matter what the situation is. 00:32:29:18 - 00:32:31:19 Unknown You start to understand why and, 00:32:31:19 - 00:32:33:00 Unknown what I think is, 00:32:33:00 - 00:32:34:10 Unknown Really interesting about 00:32:34:10 - 00:32:38:15 Unknown this type of space with connected automated vehicles is thinking about. 00:32:38:15 - 00:32:40:10 Unknown If barriers exist 00:32:40:10 - 00:32:42:18 Unknown today, will they exist 00:32:42:18 - 00:32:45:06 Unknown tomorrow or while they exist and 00:32:45:06 - 00:32:46:14 Unknown five years in ten years? 00:32:46:14 - 00:32:52:11 Unknown but yeah, being able to to understand what's driving some of people's perceptions 00:32:52:11 - 00:32:54:00 Unknown or value, 00:32:54:00 - 00:32:56:05 Unknown I think is really important for these types of 00:32:56:05 - 00:32:57:12 Unknown projects. 00:32:57:15 - 00:32:59:15 Unknown That's great. Thank you. 00:32:59:15 - 00:33:00:21 Unknown Looking ahead to, 00:33:00:21 - 00:33:02:20 Unknown wider US roll out. Obviously, 00:33:02:20 - 00:33:04:22 Unknown we're starting in Michigan, but hopefully 00:33:04:22 - 00:33:06:04 Unknown next stop the world. 00:33:06:04 - 00:33:11:05 Unknown What will U.S. highways look like and feel like in a decade? 00:33:11:09 - 00:33:12:07 Unknown So 00:33:12:07 - 00:33:16:09 Unknown we envision smart roads and cap corridors being 00:33:16:09 - 00:33:17:12 Unknown deployed on, 00:33:17:12 - 00:33:18:10 Unknown critical 00:33:18:10 - 00:33:20:22 Unknown corridors, which face outsized challenges 00:33:20:22 - 00:33:21:23 Unknown and, sir, 00:33:21:23 - 00:33:25:04 Unknown majority of road users. So, these 00:33:25:04 - 00:33:25:23 Unknown corridors, 00:33:25:23 - 00:33:30:04 Unknown vehicle and roadway technologies will integrate seamlessly 00:33:30:04 - 00:33:31:23 Unknown travelers and 00:33:31:23 - 00:33:34:09 Unknown operators will be alerted 00:33:34:09 - 00:33:35:15 Unknown immediately. Those 00:33:35:15 - 00:33:37:11 Unknown emerging roadway risks with 00:33:37:11 - 00:33:38:18 Unknown lane level precision. 00:33:38:18 - 00:33:45:20 Unknown And those insights will lead to predictive safety, operations and maintenance actions that 00:33:45:20 - 00:33:47:21 Unknown maximize roadway capacity, 00:33:47:21 - 00:33:49:04 Unknown reduce congestion, 00:33:49:04 - 00:33:51:05 Unknown maintain travel time, reliability, 00:33:51:05 - 00:33:52:09 Unknown reduce crashes, 00:33:52:09 - 00:33:52:21 Unknown and, 00:33:52:21 - 00:33:54:20 Unknown then give drivers time back. 00:33:55:01 - 00:33:55:09 Unknown Great. 00:33:55:16 - 00:33:58:09 Unknown And then, like, a steer will be there the whole way. Right, Tony? 00:33:58:12 - 00:33:59:19 Unknown Yeah. For sure. And I think, 00:33:59:19 - 00:34:02:07 Unknown I mean, as always with these projects during the first one, 00:34:02:07 - 00:34:10:13 Unknown it's a big learning for everyone. And you really think things through once. You can then take the learnings from one application and apply it somewhere else. You start 00:34:10:13 - 00:34:12:10 Unknown really, you know, getting some momentum, 00:34:12:10 - 00:34:15:07 Unknown knowing what we can take, what we want to improve on, 00:34:15:07 - 00:34:17:02 Unknown what we might want, need more information on. 00:34:17:02 - 00:34:17:19 Unknown So 00:34:17:19 - 00:34:18:14 Unknown yeah, I think it's 00:34:18:14 - 00:34:26:20 Unknown the first one is fun. But yeah, the the next few become easier and we have more of an established approach. So I think yeah, that, 00:34:26:20 - 00:34:28:06 Unknown make the studies better. 00:34:28:06 - 00:34:29:22 Unknown That was great. Thank you so much. 00:34:29:22 - 00:34:30:17 Unknown I learned a lot. 00:34:30:17 - 00:34:35:00 Unknown thanks very much for joining us. And, and thanks to you, Tony, as well. 00:34:35:00 - 00:34:35:17 Unknown Thanks, guys. 00:34:35:17 - 00:34:36:14 Unknown And thanks, Megan, 00:34:36:14 - 00:34:37:24 Unknown for your time today and 00:34:37:24 - 00:34:39:02 Unknown to hear all about 00:34:39:02 - 00:34:40:01 Unknown Kafka corridors, 00:34:40:01 - 00:34:41:09 Unknown I learned quite a lot as well, actually. 00:34:41:22 - 00:34:43:05 Unknown Well, thank you for having me. It's a 00:34:43:05 - 00:35:07:17 Unknown Ma ma ma ma ma ma ma ma ma ma ma ma ma ma ma ma ma ma ma ma ma ma.