Voices of the Industry presented by Steer - #3 How can we create equitable shared mobility in North America?

0:05
[Music] hello and welcome to voices of the
0:11
industry a podcast series bringing you leading industry voices who challenge thinking across Transportation
0:17
infrastructure and [Music]
0:26
cities hello and welcome to voices of Industry a steer podcast I am your host
0:32
alos steer leads for the new Mobility Market in North America our topic today is at the intersection of urban
0:39
Innovation and social justice shed micromobility a concept that's not just
0:44
changing how we move but who gets to move in our cities and as cities are confront with congestion climate change
0:52
and uneven access to Transit bike and E scooter sharing program have emerged as
0:57
a potential solution yet we must ask are these system reaching those you need
1:02
them most and how do we bridge the gap to ensure Equitable access across diverse local communities to explore
1:09
this transformation and their implication more specifically with me today is Laura Malone membership and
1:16
engagement director at the North American b share Association or nepsa wafia muray andigo program manager at
1:23
the city of Philadelphia and Adriel Thon executive director at MoGo Detroit bik
1:29
Shire they'll share Insight on the challenges and opportunities in creating truly
1:34
inclusive micromobility system so let's roll into the conversation and let's
1:40
start with you Lara from napsa which is an organization that has a sort of like bird's eye view on the industry the
1:46
organization has released recently a report that shows a complex picture of equity in chrom Mobility one of the most
1:52
surprising Trends you've seen and what do you think is driving it thanks Alia I
1:58
I just want to step back for just a second and give a a little bit of a recap of who nabsa is we are the North
2:04
American Bike Share and scooter share Association and each year we produce a
2:11
state of the industry report which reports on ridership metrics systems
2:16
across Canada United States and Mexico and Equity is something we also
2:23
report on to Alas point and i' I've really got two themes that I'd like to
2:28
share about from the the recent report is for this year we've seen an increase in the number of systems that offer
2:35
offer some type of adaptive program so that could be different adaptive bicycles there we we are seeing a larger
2:43
quantity of systems offering adaptive programs and I think these are driven by
2:48
systems recognizing the need to offer different types of vehicles to serve
2:53
writer needs and one of the things that I think is super interesting about this is the industry is exploring this
3:01
together if you look at a timeline of shared micro ability the first Bike Share system in North America launched
3:06
between 2008 and 2009 and then we started seeing scooters in 2017 so big
3:12
picture we're still a pretty young industry so it's really exciting to see Equity initiatives um like adaptive
3:19
programs that we're starting to see an increase of the other theme that I'm not
3:24
necessarily sure I would say it's surprising but I do it is like worth
3:29
stating is that what we see in year after year our reports is that systems
3:35
that incorporate Equity into their programs by weaving it through all the elements not siloing it on its own are
3:42
going to have the greatest impact they're going to have you know the the greatest uptake in whatever Equity
3:48
programs they're doing and I would say overall they have the most successful
3:53
metrics to share about who they're impacting and getting more people to be able to access their systems so I'd say
4:01
that's it's not just about doing like the one thing that's siloed over here that's checking a box we really see that
4:08
people weaving it into their programs into the fabric is is really impactful
4:13
and I think we have some really good examples here that will be able to talk about that's fantastic you've been doing
4:18
my transition and I think this is giving us really powerful intro to Deep dive now
4:25
into sort of like more specific CT experiences and Adriel I would like to stop with you you're steering MGO in
4:31
Detroit a city with a very complex history regarding Transportation access among other things and moo aims to serve
4:39
a wide range of people and needs in the city so could you go back a little bit on the sort of vision for MoGo but also
4:46
what's your most Innovative Equity initiative right now and how did you develop it you know the the you're
4:52
correct Detroit as a whole Metro Detroit you know the city itself is over 300 300
4:57
square miles and then you add Metro Detroit to it it's a really big big piece of it's a big area to cover right
5:03
so in launching a bike share system here the idea was obviously we have to start in some places and not be able to get to
5:09
every single place at the same time and the idea was to to really focus on some of the the transportation needs that the
5:16
Metro Detroit area has our transit system here we've got multiple bus
5:21
systems right there's a Suburban one there's an inner city one and while they work they can work together it still
5:27
there there multiple systems you know the of we don't we have a light rail system that goes about two
5:35
miles for the entire area and so you know we have the idea here and maybe
5:40
it's because it was the Motor City we used to have a very robust transportation system a mass mass
5:46
transit system here and that was dismantled in the you know 40s and 50s as the auto well the Auto industry
5:51
really ramped up here so Detroit is literally built for cars right now so with that though there are some
5:57
Financial challenges so we don't have a really robust transportation system I think going across the board right so
6:04
the idea of Bike Share was really a way for folks to be able to really to fill in those gaps it really was a first mile
6:10
Last Mile solution here but for some folks it is the only solution and you know we actually operate in two counties
6:17
in in metro Detroit so we we're one of the few unified Transportation Systems
6:22
in the area and what we we launched in 2017 we baked the idea of accessibility
6:29
and and Equity into the system so we launched with an access pass that and large part was based on uh indigo's
6:36
system and in 2018 we launched our adaptive program
6:42
which has been really really successful here it could be much much better obviously you know there's you have to
6:47
buy there could you know these things are not cheap but I think it's really important and this is the this is the most innovative solutions I think that
6:54
we're getting into now and something I'm really proud of is we're beginning just now to Electrify our adaptive Fleet so
7:00
we just we have two e trikes in the system now and it's really really exciting people are really excited by it
7:07
and I think that that's really important and and works right into the equity piece because you know we know that
7:12
ebikes typically are easier for people to ride with much less effort and so when you're talking about the Adaptive
7:18
Community I think that really is an important step in that direction so we're we're going to continue to Electrify where we can and to expand our
7:25
system so I think these a really good example and maybe before going to Philly and a question about ebike and Equity
7:32
because we know that you know going back on a bike when an adult is not something that's necessary easy and it's even
7:39
harder when you add the electric aspect of it so how did you manage within the
7:44
program that sort of balance between getting people trained to use these new this new tool I guess the thing about
7:51
the Adaptive program here is that the bikes you pretty much need to be trained how to ride them period right so you
7:57
know customer they want you has to learn how to do something right so I don't know if you've ever
8:04
written some of the or seen some of the EB some of the Adaptive vehicles but they are they could be a wide range of
8:11
shapes and sizes and fits right some of them literally you need to some of them lit need to be fitted to you so it takes
8:18
me a like a wow I still haven't mastered really writing some of them it's a
8:23
challenge right it's it's a different thing than a regular two whe bike so the adding the E component to it really
8:29
wasn't that much more of a challenge I think that you know it's likely that someone on a trike who's getting on one
8:36
of the trikes this probably is their first time one one period right so it's not like you have to go back and relearn
8:43
how to how to do this I will say that I think the electrification of The Fleets if I can go to this across the board I
8:50
think is on one hand this is how I see it working into Equity of an accessibility in again in a city like
8:57
Detroit right the uh idea that you can you know that you may have to cover like
9:02
really big distances you know it's a long it's a it's 12 13 miles between our downtown and say the first suburb
9:10
Ferndale that we have another MoGo station at right and there is a gap in there right so if if that's the way that
9:16
you Comm me to work though being able or go to your doctor or any other number of things the idea that you can do so much
9:24
faster and easier to me is what really makes the equity piece of E of electric
9:30
pedal assist bikes really important because it actually opens up access to we have seniors who who Hunty those
9:37
bikes down everywhere they can because they're just that much easier to ride on their body you know their knees you know
9:43
people may have backs etc etc and this is this is a much easier thing for them actually to rise so it actually
9:48
increases I think that opportunity to to pull people into the mix I think that's
9:53
a really powerful example of how Transportation can be a tool for social justice raia indig girl been operating
9:59
in Philly for several years now and Adriel just mentioned the program as one of the model that has been used when
10:05
they were thinking about logo so I'm quite curious of how has your approach to equity evolved and what's driving
10:13
those changes great great question so I guess our initial approach to equity and
10:19
what has always been our approach is very forign point with what lur mentioned Equity as my mentor NAA kibu
10:26
would say the fabric not the fabric softener so it needs to ined everything do and a stance that
10:34
Indigo took share from the beginning and continue to do that I would say the way
10:40
that we've evolved in our programming is really really doubling down over the
10:46
years on our relationships because our relationships with our partners
10:52
especially Our Community Partners have really been like the strong force that
10:58
keeps Indigo going like our community ambassadors and our community chion to
11:04
vouch for Indigo right we were just starting out and folks didn't know who we were and they would vouch for us and
11:10
say hey no these folks are indigo they're really good they're really trying to provide an affordable
11:16
Transportation option for our residents and for our community and having those folks vouch for us and inviting us to
11:23
the meetings it helped us to just get a foot into the door and then of course it was our job to continue to build that
11:31
trust to follow through and do what we say that what we said we were going to do we continue to sustain those
11:38
relationships so something we really try to focus on is building new relationships with new partners while
11:45
also sustaining our strong relationships most recently we started an indigo Community advisory Council it's consists
11:53
of community members that have been a part of Indo since the beginning of our
11:58
system and have supported Indigo have provided valuable feedback to us over the years
12:04
so we just kind of put that into a more structured setting we provide funding to
12:09
support all of the great feedback that they give us and we get information from them on you know what should we do about
12:16
a new pass option we're looking to implement what do we do about expansion what are your thoughts like really
12:21
getting that real time feedback from trusted community members is really helpful we've also improved some of our
12:28
program like the Indigo Community GRS program we've added additional funding to how much community and members apply
12:37
another great example is our Indigo friends and family day so this was an
12:42
event that was an idea of our community ambassadors they wanted to have like a
12:48
community day where all of their Community Partners can come and learn not just about IND but all of the great
12:54
resources that each of the communities and programs are offering they help go put that together and we've continued to
13:01
do that each year and it gets bigger and bigger so I would say kind of our missional Equity has remained the same
13:08
but we've just really doubled down on how we can innovate our programming and continue to you know build and sustain
13:15
relationships with our Community Partners and and I think this is definitely setting the stage for other
13:22
programs to look how you've been doing and and how successful it has been for for you guys and silly and Lara I I want
13:29
to go back to you the napsa report highlights various Equity programs as well you know just building on what weia
13:36
and Adriel have just shared with us can you give us some stand out other example yeah absolutely I can so some
13:45
some different examples basically what we do is is we request information from
13:51
operators Transit agencies uh operating shared micro ability and so they respond
13:58
to questions that help inform our report and so for this year I say this year all
14:03
the metrics are from 2023 so it's our 2023 shared micro ability state of the
14:08
industry report for North America examples of equity programs that we're seeing are different discount programs
14:15
so that could be a reduced path reduced Fair structure alternative payment so
14:20
alternative payment could mean using some type of alternative payment it you know maybe not using the app for Access
14:27
maybe a partnership with a library or you know physical paths that program might be using education and Outreach
14:34
programs underscoring raia's Point these are huge if people don't know that
14:39
you're doing programs writers potential writers don't know that they're a potential writer you're not reaching the
14:47
individuals who might need a bike share scooter share system as their form a transportation we also see Equitable
14:55
hiring processes across the board geographic distribution policies this
15:00
could mean you know being intentional about reaching certain areas of a City Community to making making sure that
15:08
vehicles are available for individuals to ride and then the other one which I
15:13
talked about already is adaptive vehicles and I'll note that I'm
15:19
reporting on these like Standalone but what most often we see is systems that
15:24
are incorporating elements of each maybe not all have some really robust Equity
15:31
programs within their systems absolutely and well I guess what Adriel also sh on
15:36
that specific point is just testimony of that isn't it Adriel just building on what FIA was saying and and Lara were
15:43
saying about training and the importance of Outreach could you D it a bit more on what MoGo is is doing on that front sure
15:51
I think it's really to Laura's point I love what she said that you know people have to know that they're potential
15:56
customers right that this is for them and you know think that's a challenge for most of our systems right is well
16:02
let me backtrack a little bit I think part that is so important part of the thing I think that our industry really
16:07
is challenged with is getting out of our own bubble and having the resources to
16:13
do so right so you know we had a lot of attention when we first launched right in 2017 people were following us and
16:19
stuff like that but now across the board we're kind of I don't want to say stuck with them but you know it's hard to grow
16:27
that Network right on these other on these various channels and so it's really important and one thing that we
16:34
do is we actually like wasia said we actually go out to the community we we
16:39
partner with for instance for on our access pass program we partner with other Equity focused organizations well
16:45
for rights organizations unhoused organizations all those sortes of things and we will go sometimes we will go here
16:52
and have a sign up event there where we would bring you know our old computer and then you know we often times may
16:58
give the passes away you know here in in uh in Detroit it's uh our exess pass is
17:05
five bucks it's about a $85 discount off a regular price if you receive state benefits If you're receiving state
17:11
benefits there are other challenges right you may not have a stable place to live but you may be at this place for
17:17
now right but you probably you don't have a computer you don't have these things that are barriers we take it for
17:23
granted but it's bu and I think for people to actually be able to access a bike share program or a bike share system so
17:29
it's key to actually go out to the community and to these places and then do some of the work that's there right
17:35
in person lot right so I mean that's a that's a really important way that we really do
17:41
Outreach another way you know we go into a community before we put our stations down we do community outreach meetings
17:48
too which is great because it helps us figure out exactly where the best place to put stations are we all know we may
17:56
think we know where it should be where like you know other stakeholders think one particular station should be but
18:01
then you go to ask the community and they like ain't nobody riding over there right so so that's I think really
18:08
important and then also it's doing you know when you do your marketing I think it's important that you make sure that
18:13
you meet people where you where they are not where you wish they were so you know that means I've said this before I think
18:20
my and La have probably heard me say this but you got to put if you're going to put posters of Flyers down go to the
18:26
liquor store go to the go to the the gas station that's kind of hot I know like in again in the city you've got you know
18:32
there are multiple churches around here community centers and but I feel like
18:37
the people who go there while they're important they're already activated right they're already sort of looking
18:43
for those types of things and I think you miss a whole group of people who
18:48
you're probably not getting you probably not reaching out to in other ways either right so I could go and preach the
18:53
gospel of MoGo already to a lot of folks who are interested in Progressive things and Civic oriented people who are the
19:00
ones that are tend to be going to these Community meetings etc etc but you know if you really want uh some other folks
19:06
and probably some of the folks who really need it the most meet them where they are barber shops I mean anything you know what I'm saying like places
19:12
that people go again as opposed to where you really wish they were I think it's an important message
19:18
this message about activation in the faat how can we reach people really need
19:23
the service that don't necessarily think they are fitted for it and Waf I'm quite
19:28
interesting to to better understand in in the case of inid how do you do that
19:34
and how is the support you're getting from the the local communities is helping you doing this I think it starts
19:41
with a conversation right it starts with like as Adriel said you know meeting people where they are you have to go to
19:49
the neighborhoods and the communities and the folks and just talk to them have a conversation about and it doesn't have
19:56
to be just about bik share I think that's the other thing like when I'm
20:01
engaging with a new community I'm just going to say hey let me introduce myself
20:08
I'm with the city of Philadelphia tell me about you tell me about your community tell me about some of the
20:14
things that you have going on tell me about some of the recent wins that your community organization has had tell me
20:21
about some of the barriers that you may be experiencing and from that
20:27
conversation some times you can kind of pull things that pull common things
20:33
right between what you hear from the community and what you can offer as a service so for instance if I'm talking
20:39
to a community member and one of the things they're dealing with is you know lack of reliable transation or you know
20:46
people are dealing with health issues High rates of people with heart problems or diabetes or obesity or mental health
20:54
then hey Bike Share can be a great way to be physically F physically active a
20:59
great way to help counteract some you know mental health issues a great way to
21:05
get affordable transportation to healthy food resources farmers markets affordable Transportation back and forth
21:11
to school work places people frequently go right so you want to make it you want
21:18
it's good to make bike Shar something that isn't an additional thing on people's plates cuz you got to know
21:23
these communities are already dealing with a lot right violence some of things
21:29
I've mentioned gfic right all these things are real so how can b share be not extra thing on a plate but something
21:36
that can help them with some of the other things that they're already working on I would say that is often the
21:42
approach that works the best and that I've seen work well in communities but then that helps you continue to build
21:48
that trust and are you having in events that we can come to and share about this work are there other folks that you
21:54
recommend that we talk to so it's really like you hear me talk about relationships a lot because that's really what it is like you're getting to
22:00
know someone you know you learn a bit about that person you don't well some people do but I wouldn't recommend you
22:06
you just kind of go in hot like hey this is what I mean you gotta you know take a
22:12
time take the time to get to know each other and once you build those relationships you begin to build trust
22:17
and once you have that trust you know it's important to maintain it but once you have that trust and once you break
22:23
through that wall because understanding that there's a history of mistrust for
22:28
for just reason you know reasons justification all of the things building
22:36
those relationships meeting people where they are you know and then working to implement programs that kind of you know
22:42
balance what the community needs for what you can offer like a great example that is the Indigo wils to work program
22:49
one of the common concerns that we heard from community members especially like
22:54
during the pandemic post pandemic was like access and information for the job
23:00
Network right how do you apply for jobs now when things are virtual or you know how do we get places and so we were like
23:07
okay let's do wills to work we provide folks free Workforce Development skills
23:13
like resume building networking interview skills how to do these things both in both in person and virtually and
23:20
we also provide resources information on Bike Share how to use Bike Share how to
23:26
plan out your route how if for folks who complete the prr they get a free membership to Indigo to help get
23:34
back and TOS to interviews even Transportation until you get that first
23:39
check because I remember getting a job and still need to figure out how I'm going to get there until I get my first check right so this can be a tool to
23:47
help brids that get I'd like to stay there with you Rafia on the sort of like
23:52
conversation about financial sustainability you've been talking about some programs and initiatives that AR
23:59
free on the user side but they're definitely not on the city Side so Indigo operates under the umbrella of
24:05
the city government which bring its I think own set of challenge and opportunities I'm quite curious to
24:10
better understand how the pric sector Dynamics plays out in your work and how
24:16
does this impact your ability to prioritize affordability that is a great question so you know and this is the
24:23
conversation that comes up often when people you know and there a it's a tension of like you know how do you
24:29
prioritize equity and how do you prioritize Financial sustainability I think the first thing is you know to be
24:36
open and honest right have these conversations you know like the city of Philadelphia our operators bicycle
24:43
transit systems we communicate with each other we talk almost every day if there's
24:48
something that we want to implement we talk about okay how can we implement this in in a way that is Affordable and
24:57
a way that is is that helps the system continue to be financially sustain and a
25:03
way that we can implement this program and keep it going right so for instance I would love to put things out for free
25:10
but I only want to put it out for free if we can afford to sustain it and maintain it at no cost I would rather
25:17
charge you know $5 obviously something that's still affordable but I would
25:22
rather charge $5 than not charge anything if I can make sure that we can maintain this program
25:32
very H First Step say also another step is
25:38
your your contracts or whatever you have whatever you have in that contract those regulations is so important because
25:45
there are some things that people can't afford and then there are some things that people can afford when they're
25:51
forced to do it from you know you you start to make things work when it's a
25:56
requirement and you know we've all seen examples of that so you know it's
26:02
there's certain things your contracts and things like that but I do think there's also a point where you just need to be honest and understand that there
26:10
is you know a financial aspect to it b share or share market mobility in
26:15
general a lot of people assume that share market Mobility re receive the
26:20
same type of subsidies that like other Transit agencies receive like we don't get the same type of funding that that
26:28
our you know transit system gets here you know the outside doesn't understand
26:33
that so while they can do a lot of things or discount a lot of things cability we can't you know we're relying
26:40
on Fair box recovery sponsorships advertising grants all of those things
26:46
and so you know we have to really balance a lot you know I always say when
26:51
your man in the sh Mobility Program you have to be a lawyer you got to know how to do contracts you got to be an account
26:58
got budgets you know all of these things right it's like so so yeah I say all
27:04
that to say that you know it really is a balance it really needs to be an open honest conversation and there are
27:11
certain things that you do need to require but make sure that once you implement them you can do them in a
27:16
sustainable way because you don't want to offer something to the public PA people come have people begin to rely on
27:22
it and then have to pull it back yeah I I think this tension has been in the core of this industry for for long time
27:28
and laa I'm quite curious to to hear a bit more about what Napa thinks about that and if you have any other maybe
27:34
example for members or best practices you've heard about so I'm going to underscore all the things that wfia said
27:41
like being upfront being honest Community engagement to like get people
27:46
educated and input input on programs is so so so critical because if you put
27:55
let's just use an example of like a past program that people can't access or it's just
28:02
like too challenging or it's just not working for the the writer or potential
28:07
writer then that is potentially a wasted time resource and while some might look
28:14
at it and be like well you know we did we did the thing it's not enough it's not enough to not be in you know
28:22
constant development of of feedback and implementing that feedback to programs
28:27
I'll also say say that you know underscoring the tension of financial
28:32
sustainability and Equity so we know that uh Equity programs and prioritizing
28:41
Equity there is a financial piece of it so I love what olafia said about you
28:46
know wanting to do something and yeah it would be great if everything was free
28:52
however that's not sustainable and so creating a balance to be able to have
28:58
you know successful programs that are also sustainable in the the long term
29:04
and I I think that what we're starting to see what we've been seeing over the last few years is we've seen more Public
29:12
Funding support for shared micro ability you know that could be local level state
29:18
level Regional provincial there are some things that have been changing and what
29:24
our hope is that organizations operators community will take that funding and start to
29:32
implement it in prioritizing Equity into their systems and like I said before just like weaving Equity into the types
29:40
of things that they do so if I were to share just like examples best best
29:46
practices it's it's probably reiterating some you know things that Adriel and weia have already talked about is
29:52
communication Community engagement and then also just like a feedback loop of
29:57
what what's working what's not working because yeah if it's not working or if it's not meeting the writer's needs or
30:04
if it's creating more barriers then it's not it's not going to work it's and I
30:11
can't state that enough is creating more barriers wouldn't help people getting on
30:17
bikes or scooters within cities and yeah I think I think you're right I I do and
30:22
would love to Deep dive a little bit more into the question of monitoring and what kind of can we use it in here
30:29
whether they qualitative or quantitative before doing so though Adriel you're approaching this from a different angle
30:35
being a nonprofit or are you gu is my question in a world where some of the
30:41
funds are equ focused on measurable impacts I'm just wondering how has it been for MoGo and what type of like
30:48
narrative do you have to use to really balance expectation to affordability and
30:54
Equity yeah I mean you're right as a specifically Miss based nonprofit organization all the same challenges are
31:01
there and I think to to an extent the expectations are maybe a little higher strangely because we're not connected to
31:08
this we're not a part of the city we're not part of one of the dots right so I think that there there are people who I
31:15
think in their head and this is really really what Lauren and what FIA said is there's probably an expectation or
31:20
there's a want of just why can't I just get on this thing and go and take it we have people who do they try it in their
31:27
own way by charge you know doing the chargebacks which if folks don't know what that is that's where you know so
31:33
you charge something in your credit card and then you later say that it was either a fraudulent charge or something
31:39
else so either way your money gets refunded people do that stuff is really really painful right but I think that
31:45
it's weird I think the expectations of I think for so on the metric side our
31:50
expectation I think is more about writers ship and usefulness right so it really becomes a thing of like people
31:56
want to see people using this where you know those types of things I think is our highest metric but obviously like to
32:03
wfia point you know all this stuff takes money and when I go in to talk to a
32:08
sponsor or a potential sponsor or something like that you know it's I have to show them the value of writers ship
32:15
right and also speaking you know sort of a different language you got the city station so there's an advertising opportunity right there or a branding
32:22
opportunity right so on and so on so it's different me or different expectations I think for different people
32:28
no one has asked yet and except the people for my dire coders more is you
32:34
know have have we made a million dollars yet I mean which we have but you know they're not asking those types of
32:40
questions which is really interesting but I think people also too May if they look at it as a
32:47
transportation there if they look at it as a like a one of the dots right I think for years those have not been
32:53
money makers um in a lot of ways if you look at his own businesses they're kind of loss leaders and a and a city government and but they're it's a public
33:00
service so they're invested in and I think that people think that that is what's happening with us if they think that at all right so yeah we don't uh
33:07
publicly we don't get asked that question a lot so I haven't had to do a lot of different things to meet those
33:13
expectations or challenges well I hope I answered that question did
33:19
I no you all you all as you said it's it's always a mix of like some
33:24
constitutive elements that I think even report like not reports every year is also helping setting the stage at the
33:30
national level and then there's the sort of like more implicit balance and conversation you also have to have on
33:36
these topics and I think these one are just more complex and less set into or less institutionalized than we wish
33:43
there were probably not making your daily life easy every day but it's also what give you I guess a bit of flexibility yeah I think you know I
33:50
think it's it's it's really cool because well we we have a great partnership with the city there's not being connected a
33:57
lot quite a bit more flexibility I think in a lot of different things right while I would like to have that steady funding
34:03
source goad be you know a tax revenue or something like that I'm also not necessarily A B I guess burden is in the
34:10
right word I'm not I'm not restricted by some of some of the things that you know we know that City agencies or
34:16
governments have to are restricted by so it's it's really nice to to that's the flexibility that's the trade-off right
34:23
like I don't have that steady you know I'm not being funded by the city but I also have a lot of flexibility in in
34:31
where we can operate what we can do where we you know what I'm saying those types of things it's a really interesting place to me no absolutely
34:38
and I think this is quite interesting to have both the three of you but definitely seeing like the difference
34:43
between a city model and a nonprofit model for that point Lara do you have anything else You' like to add on
34:49
funding yeah absolutely I I wanted to just frame funding for for those who
34:54
might be tuning in about where shared micromobility funding comes from so at
35:00
some point I think both wfy and Adriel talked about different sponsorship opportunities but if we step back and
35:07
take a look at where does the funding come from to employ shared micromobility like the the workforce and you know
35:14
operations and actual equipment it is a mix of different things um so there's
35:20
examples of sponsorship systems are supported by sponsorship there are federal and state grants that are ail
35:27
ailable generally for Capital Equipment not which usually can't be applied to
35:32
operating costs advertising is something we see also so you know maybe some
35:37
advertising opportunity signage on you know stations user Revenue user revenue
35:44
is also a funding stream some systems have private donors that might be you
35:50
know an individual or some type of foundation that is supporting shared micro ability City and Transit funding
35:56
is an example we see as well so that's going to be a little more local funding than the federal state we also
36:02
historically have seen some venture capital investment into shared micro ability and then also certain types of
36:10
Private Business funding so just wanted to frame that because while we're getting into the conversation about the
36:17
financial element of equity and shared micro abilities I do want to acknowledge
36:22
that the funding streams for shared micro ability is diverse and sometimes it is is a balance for organizations to
36:30
be sustainable based on the variety of different funding opportunities that are
36:36
or potentially might not be available I think this is a really important recap
36:41
and it is true that we seeing two sort of like half but we're not seeing and
36:46
overseeing all the spectrum of potential and opportunities and challenges that goes with ponding in North America so
36:53
thanks for that laa as we look towards the horizon of sh micromobility well it's very clear that there's not one
36:59
path to equity and affordability and I'm quite curious to better understand from each of you what you see is the biggest
37:07
obstacle maybe in in this journey moving forward and War I'd like to start with you I would say the biggest obstacle
37:16
with Equity I will say is two things one we talked about it like the financial
37:22
support to move these things along like every other so there's so many prrams
37:28
here that receive support from the city to help them you know Implement Equity
37:34
Focus work or just keep going in general especially things like Transportation that's a need right so I would say that
37:42
financial support and really having a share rifle Mobility be seen as a form
37:49
of public transportation because for some reason many folks and larger
37:54
entities do not see share market Mobility as that but 100% is so I would
38:00
say the financial support and the other one is just like a real true commitment
38:05
to this work like there's one thing to say okay we're going to focus on Equity there's one thing you know to have it in
38:12
your mission statement or to hire your diversity Equity inclusion officer that we've seen you know we saw a lot of that
38:19
happen and we saw a lot of and we also saw a lot of that and right so important
38:26
to a true commitment to it and I feel like once once you know operators cities
38:34
organizations nonprofits really have that true commitment to equity and not just words but in action and you know
38:42
everyone is holding themselves accountable to implementing it and you know not just putting something out we
38:49
talked earlier in this conversation about you know was one thing to put out a low income pant option but if people
38:56
don't know about it especially the people that need to know about it know about it is useless or if it's not
39:02
accessible or functional right like did you test it out see if people can actually like sign up for this program
39:09
effectively and understand the sign up process and understand what needs to be done to be a part of this program
39:16
effectively like that digital divide and other things are also a barrier so moving with intentionality and moving in
39:23
a meaningful way when it comes to equity is very important in addition that financial support to do these things
39:29
effectively cuz people you know not just adri and I but we know so many people in
39:35
in this industry that have done so much on so little or with so little and just imagine if these groups or organizations
39:42
were able to get just a little bit of funding right think of the impact that the industry and folks can have right I
39:48
think these are super powerful message that you you're giving us and adri I I really wonder if you want to add to it
39:54
or build it in a different way yeah I I I mean again agree with everything my
40:00
says and and yeah you would be shocked by what people are able to make happen out here with nothing I mean literally
40:07
nothing I think mov they having this Paradigm Shift where you know there's there's push back on Equity now and
40:14
having a real concept of what that means and that it's not a bad word and that it's not a zero some game right like
40:21
just because you get something doesn't mean someone else has to lose right and I think one of the biggest challenges
40:26
there were is I think that broad belief right that this is if you don't their think their
40:33
Equity programs or whatever to make it equal right to try to get it to be equal
40:38
and if if like it's not beneficial to you if it doesn't apply to you I guess is what I'm saying then that's okay you
40:45
know it's it's it's not you're not going to lose anything from that and I think that you know especially when you go
40:50
into neighborhoods or other other locations other cities around here convincing folks that that is beneficial
40:57
we've got example I guess is we've got some communities here in M Detroit and
41:02
then there's one that's literally sandwiched between two cities that we operate in who because they're a little
41:08
wealthier simply said we don't want it right so totally misunderstanding what
41:13
what a bike share system is about totally misunderstanding what the mission is and I think really sort of
41:19
misunderstanding that when we when they hear about equity and they hear about accessibility and these these types of things that they again I'll just say
41:29
misunderstand uh who those who who who who that applies to and what those programs are for right so it's like
41:36
that's cute you have money your you know you're square mile of a really wealthy neighborhood but you've got a bus stop
41:42
right there on your main road and so that so someone understands the idea of
41:48
mass transit and getting people from the where they have to go this is just an addon to that and actually equalizes
41:53
quite a few different things right so it's about providing more access not not taking it back and coupling Equity
42:00
programs is suggest that we're trying to increase the access to this right folks who really can benefit from it and you
42:06
if you like it that's great but there are some people who actually could really really really benefit from it and
42:12
so you know whether you're commuting to work or try to get to school or the doctor's office or wherever you're some
42:19
folks may choose to to do Bike Share or use uh micro Mobility other folks don't
42:24
have that choice this is what they have so I think really that's an obstacle I
42:29
think to the Future that we really need to address is is having a sort of a mental paradigm shift and how we think
42:35
about these things yeah I think following that will follow the fund the funds will follow that right yeah it's
42:40
it's this consideration about almost like public service we always go back to isn't it I feel like has been a notion
42:47
that the industry has been trying to really like push forward because it also go back to Rafia what you were saying
42:53
about the resilience like we need to be able to go outside of the industry
42:59
turmoil that we see we've seen in the past few years and sort of really helping cities and distri maker
43:05
considering sh micromobility as a longstanding options for the cities and
43:10
for the communities isn't it Lara I'm quite curious to hear a bit more what napsi is thinking on this topic so I
43:18
I'll I'll again just agree and underscore Adriel and wo's point I think when nepsa takes a look at the
43:25
challenges that that our members and the industry are facing number one is well
43:33
there's two of them either they can be numbered one or two but the first one I'll share about is the the the money
43:40
funding it does take an investment it can be an investment of time and
43:45
personnel and also you know actual money to have um successful Equity programs
43:53
and that is you know the the time is also uh gets to the second point of
43:59
prioritizing Equity if if you are not prioritizing Equity if you're not
44:05
incorporating into the things that you're doing if it's not a lens that you're looking through then it's it can
44:13
make these things challenging and very siloed and it can make it feel like a a
44:18
checkbox so I think that those are those are two huge barriers that I think the
44:25
industry is facing and one of the things that nabsa can can
44:30
support is you know both Adriel and Rafia talked about like doing so much
44:36
with so little and our hope my hope is that we can get people together to say
44:42
look what we did look what look what we pulled from here are some examples of some like things that we're doing here's
44:47
things that worked here's things that didn't work and that's what that's what NSA does we bring across you know
44:54
nonprofit for-profit and public agencies where a cross- sector organization that
45:00
wants to bring everybody together to say how can we move the needle forward for shared micro ability and Equity is one
45:08
of those very important elements to us and we're hoping that um bringing people
45:13
together we can be helpful to make things happen and to help organizations
45:20
operators and programs prioritize equity and advocate for funding that's going to
45:27
help support those programs and I've been in conference at napsa I've seen
45:33
this conversation between cities from that are sometimes very far away from each other just hearing what works well
45:40
in you know one area what works well in the others and hopefully building from it and building from like the knowledge
45:46
that everyone is sharing with each other so I think it's it's a really important and core element to that thanks for
45:51
sharing that l so as you approach the end of our conversation I guess I want to push us to think little big and to
45:58
IND indulge a little bit of a policy fantasy if you had a magic wand and you could Implement one Equity Focus policy
46:05
across all sh micromobility system tomorrow what would it be Lara could we start with
46:12
you this is hard it's hard it's it's it's also exciting because it's kind of
46:18
that like what what could we do also I mean before I answer acknowledging that
46:24
Shar m cability is is Young and I know like some people will be like oh yeah
46:29
well we've seen Bike Share in cities for a decade decades not long in the
46:36
transportation story it's really really not so a magic wand I think for me it
46:43
would be more available funding more recognition of shared micro ability as a
46:50
legitimate form of transportation and prioritizing Equitable access for that
46:55
so the policy change would Shar mic Mobility as a form of transportation and
47:02
recognize across the board across all the industry that that would be wonderful because I think it would be a
47:09
domino effect of opportunities for programs across North America thanks
47:15
Lara adre I if I add the magic wand I would I guess give you the funding piece
47:21
so that people can really be in places that really need to have to have be served you know if I sat my fingers I
47:27
mean really it's like I would magically have a station with x m bikes in every
47:33
looking cranny of the city because it's a lot of those places tend to be underserved underpopulated so on and so
47:40
on and so again these are typically the places where we find folks who actually can benefit from it the most who can
47:46
benefit from you know an equitable Bike Share system that would be my magic wand uh was for forers across the the world
47:54
or the country to be able to get this into that really need it thanks adri
48:00
Andia I would say one policy that that I would Implement across every system for
48:07
me it would be adaptive honestly I'm surprised that it isn't something that's
48:13
just like required for Shar am Mobility s or just any transportation option
48:19
period I think you know adaptive b share programs are you know there's people
48:25
with different abilities and disabilities and being able to provide transportation options for them is a
48:31
need right and if it was required and you know requires to be implemented
48:37
across every system then like systems that don't have it wouldn't have to be trying to figure out how to fight to get
48:42
it and those who are currently doing it will have even more resources to make it
48:47
even better so like I know for me I'm really looking forward to seeing everyone at the Naps conference here in
48:53
Philadelphia next month to talk to folks and learn more about how you know
48:59
awesome adaptive programs like the one in MoGo and Portland and others are implemented and you know really continue
49:06
the conversation about how we can make this a universal systemwide Poli Ser say
49:13
as opposed to just like you can do it if you want right that just sounds so so weird to me so yeah might will be
49:20
adaptive thanks Rafia so it's time to wrap up and I want to thank all of you
49:26
for this very rich and Nuance discussion thank you for like shedding the light not only on the mechanics of sh microen
49:32
but also the very philosophy of how we build and govern or cities to our listeners the next time you see your
49:38
shed bike or scooters on your street I hope you'll see it not just as a vehicle but a small part of the largest stories
49:45
of urban transformation and I am Anna this has been a voices of the industry
49:51
until next time keep thinking keep questioning and above all keep moving